Comments on: A List Apart Redesigns, Makes Me Weep

By: Nathan

Nathan — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Wow, I must be a dummy cause I thought the new design “shat” all over the old one…

I can understand people have expectations when it comes to such a high profile redesign, but honestly I think some people are being a little over critical… Is that perhaps because they don’t like seeing people design something that they can’t?

From ALA:

We are still working out some bugs. (And yes, darlings, that may even include one or two XHTML validation bugs.) A few things that we will soon do suavely, we currently do a bit crudely. Nevertheless, here we are. (Love it? Hate it? Let us know.)

I say good on them, they have created something very nice and I for one won’t frown on them for trying!

Cheers.

By: Joe Clark

Joe Clark — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Christian, the new site was held up while the CMS was being built. And I’ll thank you not to discount the three new articles published today, one of them mine.

By: Collin

Collin — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

It doesn’t matter that they didn’t design their site to look perfect at 800×600. Consider their target audience and the percentage of higher resolutions is much greater then that of other web sites. How many people here have 800×600 screens?

With that said, some people don’t like to have their browsers maximized all the time. For instance, I have my monitor sectioned off into 3 areas. The main area being about 800 pixels wide for browsing while the top right of my screen is playing a video. (Currently Pinky & The Brain) – But, alas, I have the option to maximize across my entire screen to solve the issue so I can live with it.

Resolution aside, this is a great design. Very clean and subtle colors that won’t be getting in the way of your reading. With so many overpowering designs it is nice to see sites like this keep content as the center of attention.

By: Adrian L.

Adrian L. — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Aside from resolution issues, and my opinions on the design, there are technical deficiencies with this redesign. The main navigation options (Articles, Topics, About, etc.) are lost at larger type sizes (two steps up from “normal”) in both Safari and Firefox.

I haven’t even looked at it using Internet Explorer, because I’d never judge someone’s site by the way IE rendered it.

Why do those with font sizes set larger than normal lose the main navigation?

By: Su

Su — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Really nice. The subtle details are particularly pleasing, as usual. There are some elements that honestly don’t make sense to me, though. I can’t figure out what the logo tab/box thing is supposed to be, and especially why only the thin black line of the header bar overlaps it. I don’t get the logo, but have to admit that it’s always seemed more of an exercise in styling than particularly representative of anything. (I’m going to get crucified for that, aren’t I?)

The XHTML t-shirt is…disturbing.

By: Matthew Pennell

Matthew Pennell — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

@Adrian L: What are you talking about? I could bump up the text size a dozen times and the main navigation works fine.

By: Adrian L.

Adrian L. — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

@ Matthew Pennel: Tried that on a 12-inch Apple laptop? The main nav keeps expanding to the right, sans horizontal scrollbars, leaving anyone using “non-standard” type sizes in Safari or Firefox on a 1024×768 screen with incomplete nav.

That’s what I’m talking about.

By: Melissa Gray

Melissa Gray — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

I’m very undecided about the re-design. The top navigation bugs me for some reason, I still can’t work out why. And using Opera 8.02 with a resolution of 1680 x 1050 the Â« Previous page | Next page Â» links at the bottom overlap the footer. And on page /articles?page=2 I cant use the menu unless I hover over the top of the words, where the colour bar appears. It seems to work OK on the other pages though.

*shrug* I think I spend too much of my days testing…

By: Ian

Ian — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Anyone else find the code too hard to read? Just seems far to small to me.

By: David Chien

David Chien — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

Regarding the adjustable color pallette for every issue feature... That 's actually one of the subtle changes that I discovered works well with presenting issue changes, etc. On this site that I worked on, we took hints from the print magazine and used the magazine's colored border to change the site (the color changes according to the issue). That way when a regular viewer goes to the site, they immediately know if a new issue was released. Examples of the changes: Issue #62 - Dark blue Issue #63 - Burgundy Issue #67 - Purple love

By: Ralph Spoilsport

Ralph Spoilsport — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

If you separate the design from the markup, there is really not much to talk about here. There are some elements I would question, and others are very nice, but nothing terrible and nothing great.

The only reason we are talking about this design, is because it is ALA.

By: Steven

Steven — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

I so wish I could invest more time and energy into your ongoing discussion of the finer points of contemporary design. Unfortunately, other, more mundane/ practical, matters bekon for my attention. I will agree, however, with those who simply appreciate the work for what it is, and abhore the endless criticisms it has drawn.

And, I believe there is, by the way, a thing called being “overly critical” in design — it’s when you’ve fallen into a relativity paradigm so deeply and may have forgotten that the only way out is through commitment.

That’s when/ where the designer exhibits intellectual maturity; this is in acknowledging the importance of relativity (or of criticism, in general), though realizing that for all practical purposes (and design is, for many out there, a practical endeavor) there’s no need to settle for it’s repetitious, circular, inconclusiveness.

Anyway, that’s what I think. What do you got?

By: Melissa Gray

Melissa Gray — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

@ Adrian:
No more critical than I expect people to be about my work. I imagine the parties responsible for the redesign are more than happy to hear people’s concerns.

Exactly. If nobody was being critical about the errors and such, they might not get fixed.

I don’t believe there’s ever a way of being over critical in design.

By: Adrian L.

Adrian L. — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

“honestly I think some people are being a little over critical”

No more critical than I expect people to be about my work. I imagine the parties responsible for the redesign are more than happy to hear people’s concerns.

By: Mark

Mark — Tue, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000

@ Nathan

“honestly I think some people are being a little over critical”

Amen.